I noticed the "Lotus Notes Sucks" meme has resurfaced and is actively being pushed under by various Notes stalwarts (see here and here), principally because of the Lotus Notes Sucks website:
[from Lotus Notes Sucks]
Why does Lotus Notes suck? Except for security, the reasons include:
- The user interface is by far the worst there is for professionally written software. This doesn't mean every other email application is good, just that Lotus Notes is terrible. Having used about a dozen email applications over the years, I can authoritatively state that Lotus Notes is the worst. Which email applications have I used?
- Unix mail
- Zmail
- Pine
- Some ancient WordPerfect product from the early 1990s
- Outlook
- Outlook Express
- cc:Mail
- And others I can't remember.
- It displays useless and incomprehensible error messages.
- Lotus Notes is slow, ugly-looking and violates all sorts of GUI conventions.
- It deletes mail messages when you don't expect it to.
It a confusing, horrible mess. It is truly awful. I don't use Lotus Notes for anything but email—and only because I have to. I avoid using Lotus Notes as much as possible. Its scheduling, calendar, messaging, to do list—everything about it just sucks. Don't take my word for how much it sucks. Go to the examples! The examples show flaws from Lotus Notes version 5.0.8.
The author is purportedly an employee of some company where he is forced to use Lotus Notes, and it really, really irks him. Bad.
The defense of Lotus Notes is jui-jitsu-like, requiring agility and indirection. The argument runs like so.
Lotus Notes is a great technology/product. It was designed to be a platform on which collaborative applications can be developed, to do all sorts of things. It, as a result, has a very complex and sophisticated core, which is truly a marvel to behold, if you are the sort of person -- tool developer, for example -- who can appreciate such things. It isn't fair to evaluate Lotus Notes, the platform, based on the email and calendar applications that run on that platform. They may be less than wonderful, but Lotus Notes is great.
This is a lot of mealy-mouthed bait-and-switch.
First of all, Lotus Notes is a hog. It is huge, an application platform with pretensions of being an operating system. Ozzie, the architect behind Notes, clearly decided that the operating systems in wide use at the time of its design, just before the rise of the Web, were based on the wrong model, and he decided to rectify that (like he tried to do again, later, with even less success with Groove... although he managed to sell that to Microsoft. Go figure.). What were the flaws he wanted to fix? In a computer network, people will naturally create local files on their PCs, and this is an impediment to collaboration. But the operating systems know nothing about human striving toward collaborative goals, and they make it difficult to share files and the information within them effectively. And so, the answer? A big collaboration platform, that will support collaboration by putting a big, fat, slow abstraction layer above the operating systems being used.
And oh, by the way, let's stick an email solution on there too. And a calendar.
The problem is, in the world of the 90s and into the present day, email was the centerpoint of everything, even for people using Notes... because most people in the world don't have Notes, and you need to collaborate with them, too.
So, naturally, Notes The Platform is judged by comparison with alternative solutions that allow you to communicate and coordinate with anyone, anywhere... not just with other users of the same collaboration product you are using. The point that is missed by the Lotus Notes advocates is that people want to be able to communicate, collaborate, and coordinate with anyone, not just those who are using the same programs as them. That's why email was the killer app of Web 1.0 -- it worked that way. And Notes has fallen by the wayside, an asterisk in the collaboration chronicles, but all being said, not really very successful -- aside from the acquisition by IBM as a counter to Microsoft's enterprise email dominance.
[An aside: I happened to be in the IBM headquarters the day that the Lotus acquisition was announced, walking around with a Lotusphere PC bag, and I didn't understand for several hours why people where giving me the thumbs up as I walked around.]
Ozzie was right and he was wrong. Yes, the OSes of the day were badly designed with regard to our need for collaboration; but building a big, fat, slow platform to build collaborative apps on is the wrong approach. Even building a small, not so slow platform is the wrong approach. The right thing to do is to build collaboration into the apps that people are using. Or build small, focused collaborative apps that do one thing right. This is one of the lessons of Web 2.0.
Of course, today, we have the modern web infrastructure to exploit, and better OSes, and more bandwidth, and faster PCs. So I am willing to cut the Notes guys some slack since they were developing back in the pleistocene, but I still think they took the wrong fork in the road. That's one of the reasons that something as uncollaborative as Outlook kicked their ass, no matter how much "better" of a platform Notes was.
1. Sim' on January 7, 2006 08:14 PM writes...
I feel the next few years will be very interesting in the realm of corporate application platforms.
Web 2.0 is all well and good - but can you run your enterprise with it ? Perhaps if you are a small company and people are 99% of your assets, and collaboration is the only thing that matters.
But for people who need real application functionality - who have *complex* computing requirements - the web just isn't enough.
Notes was very very good as an application platform, and was (still is) "good enough" (in my opinion) as an email client.
We're on the cusp of a very big step forward in enterprise computing. I think web browsers will play a very big part in this, but I also think that low cost-of-ownership server-managed clients will make a massive difference to the client computing platform of the future.
Collaboration is critically important - Lotus have always preached that - but it's not the only thing that runs a business.
Permalink to Comment2. Harold Jarche on January 7, 2006 09:17 PM writes...
At the time, Notes was the best (the only collaborative platform that really worked). I agree, Notes is dead and Ozzie didn't really make much of a splash with Groove. A term that I have heard before is "Overcome by Events", which I believe happened to Mr. Ozzie.
Permalink to Comment3. Rob McDonagh on January 7, 2006 10:11 PM writes...
Does Notes suck? Sure.
The key point you seem to have missed is that it manages to suck much less than its competition. Exchange? Please, we really need email servers where one corrupt mailbox takes down the entire company. Outlook? Outlook is so brilliantly designed it has spawned an entire industry to deal with its many gaping security holes.
What's the worst thing people can say about Notes, in comparison? It's ugly. Oh, boo hoo. Give me an enterprise class, industrial strength email and application architecture over a pretty face every time. If I want pretty, I'll watch the WB...
Permalink to Comment4. Mike Rundle on January 8, 2006 12:21 AM writes...
I hear ya Stowe, Lotus Notes sucks bigtime. My girlfriend is actually a Software Engineer in the Lotus group at IBM, so I'll pass this on to her. I think she'll agree that the UI is awful ;)
Permalink to Comment5. Ed Brill on January 8, 2006 01:44 AM writes...
@4 Mike, I believe a lawyer would object to your comment as speculative, but OK. More to the point, as is noted on the "Lotus Notes sucks" website, and as I've blogged about, the work going on now for Lotus Notes "Hannover" is all about making the UI fantastic, leading-edge, and addressing the core mail/calendar/contacts applications.
@Stowe - I've posted some comments at http://www.edbrill.com/ebrill/edbrill.nsf/dx/stowe-boyd-joins-the-notes-sucks-meme (sorry, my blog doesn't support trackback yet). I'm not sure it's realistic to look at Notes as all failure and past tense, when it's a strong and growing part of what IBM software is doing today - and investing in for tomorrow.
Permalink to Comment6. Andrew Tetlaw on January 8, 2006 06:58 AM writes...
You seem to have missed the other quite important part of Lotus Notes, the server: Domino. Domino is a web server.
I've been building web based collab apps in Lotus Notes since 1997.
Domino provides: a complete web app framework, back end database, full text indexing for your web app, user identity/role management with session based single signon, security down to the paragraph level. In short, a modern web infrastructure.
So as far as your comments about 'we have the modern web infrastructure to exploit' go, well, I don't think you know what you're talking about.
Permalink to Comment7. Bill Wood on January 8, 2006 09:10 PM writes...
Yawn...
Permalink to Comment8. Sean Burgess on January 9, 2006 03:31 PM writes...
The issue I have with this and any other columns that say a given product sucks is their lacks of truly constructive criticism and examples of other technologies that actually do it better. In this case, there may be other email platforms out there that are better than Notes/Domino, but I haven't worked with them. All of the platforms I have worked with (Outlook/Exchange,Groupwise,OpenMail,cc:Mail) have all had their shortcomings and none of them had the breadth of flexibility that Notes offers. I mean, if you really can't stand the way Notes Mail looks or works, a top notch Notes Developer can make it look however you want. Even when IT management decides that it will be "cheaper" to run Outlook and Exchange for email, Notes/Domino stays around for years, if not forever, simply because there is nothing else that can do what it does. In fact, if you really love Outlook (which I don't understand), you can easily setup a connector on Domino to allow users to access their mail via Outlook.
And I hate to break it to you, but email is still the killer app in the enterprise and the web. Almost nothing gets done in business without using it. Just look at all the email being sent from Amazon to get a clue as to how central it has become to everyone's web experience. Any workflow that's any good uses notifications or forms via email to drive the process. The first thing that user's ask for when developing requirements for a new application is for notification on status changes. They are not asking for an RSS feed or a Java App that runs on the desktop!
As far as Notes users only being able to collaborate with other Notes users, comments like that show your ignorance to the progress of the last 10 years. Show me another platform that supports as many ways to connect as Domino does. Have a Notes client, great! If not, just use your web browser to connect over HTTP. Or use your RSS reader to get the feed. Or use .Net to pull data from a Domino Web Service. Or use any mail client in the world to access your mail over POP3 or IMAP. Or use and XML parser to pull data AND design from Domino via DXL. And the list goes on.
Your idea of building small focused collaborative apps is not new to the Notes Community. It's what we have been doing for over 20 years. Things as simple as a Discussion database, which take less than 5 minutes to create and are accessible via a Notes client and web client without customization, to full blown CRM solutions robust enough to be run by some of the largest companies in the world. But the important thing that you missed is that you need a robust platform to easily and quickly build your apps on.
Are there things about Notes that suck? Hell yeah. Are there less things now that suck than there were in version 6? 5? 4? Absolutely, and there are more things to love, also. Are there things that Notes doesn't do well? Yep and good Notes professionals know what those things are. But I have yet to see another platform which gives you an ROI that ever approaches what the Domino platform will give you.
Sean---
Permalink to Comment9. Anonymous on January 9, 2006 04:13 PM writes...
uhm ??? is this Microsoft FUD press ??
Permalink to Comment10. Claire Rand on January 10, 2006 08:26 AM writes...
I think a few people miss the point, the majority (i'd guess) of end users don't care about domino, which may or may not be the bees knees. the problem is the notes client. IBM need a windows version that looks and works like a windows app, probably a mac version that looks and works like a mac app. linux... yeah well that could look like anything but the UI needs to be easier to use.
I hear of 'training programmes' to teach people how to use notes... umm well its the only email program i've heard of that needs them.
it may do everything, but there are programs out there that do the individual bits a hell of a lot better. and as has been pointed out. if not everyone you need to work with has notes, well at some point it fails.
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